help needed urgently!!!

[MotherBear]

Well, I'd be asking them 'If the WHV isn't the right visa for this situation, then which one is?' Ask for their advice as they are the ones who should know. The WHV allows you to work for a certain length of time, then you are supposed to be 'on holiday' for the remainder of visa's life. It seems ideal because of the length of time it covers, especially if you can get a 23-month one. If you went in on a Visit Visa you wouldn't be able to stretch it quite long enough to cover the required 12 months.

[kiaora!!]

ok, but I m a German national so I can only get the whv for 12months.

I m not so sure about the work regulations. it used to be don't work for more than 3months with the same employer, but the regulations changed in Oct 07 and this bit has been taken out. It now only says, you are not permitted to seek permanent employment. What exactly this means is not stated anywhere, but I read somewhere that every office in NZ has different rules for how 'permanent work' is defined

[MotherBear]

Originally Posted by kiaora!!

ok, but I m a German national so I can only get the whv for 12months.

Ah, I did wonder about your nationality because your English is so......English . Quite a lot of Brits already live abroad when they start to think about emigrating so I thought you might be one of them. That's a shame as a 23-month WHV would have been great for your needs. A 12-month one would still do but you'd have to clear it with INZ about what would happen after that time while you were putting in your application under the Partnership Policy.

I know if a Brit is in NZ on a Visit Visa and puts in an application for PR during their visit, they can apply for an extension of the VV on the grounds that they have a PR application going through. I don't know how you would stand with doing that on a WHV or whether you'd be allowed to transfer onto a VV to give you the extra time for your PR application to go through. It does make it more complicated if you can't stay in NZ beyond the 12 months of the WHV. Even if you ran out of time once your VV expired I doubt it would matter if you had to leave NZ until your PR came through because your PR application would already be underway with INZ.

I'm assuming you don't have any skills that NZ wants so that you could apply for a Work Permit if you found a job offer? I'm clutching at straws here.

Really what INZ has said to you is that you're guilty before you've committed the crime - in NZ anyway. It's not fair that they're judging you purely on a past misdemeanour in another country although I can understand them being very cautious about it all. You definitely need to talk the whole thing through with them.

[kiaora!!]

haha :) well I have lived in Australia for the last 4years so maybe that's why my english is so ... english ;)

I have already lived with my partner for just over 3months so we only need another 9months and the 12months working holiday visa would be more than enough, as after 9months I can put in my application for PR and I ll still have 3months to go on the whv
In Australia they just put you on a bridging visa while waiting for the PR to come through, because once you apply for the visa inside Australia you have to be in Australia when a decision is being made so obviously they won't make you leave
Not sure about the rules in NZ, though I have read that if you put an application for PR in and the 12months are not up, they put your application on hold and give you a work permit until the time is up.
You can get a work permit under partnership for 1year if you haven't been together for the full year, if you've been together for more than a year you can get the permit for up to 2years, but with this work permit under partnership you don't have to have a job offer at all, you purely have to prove that you are at the time of application living together in a stable and genuine relationship.
I was thinking about applying for this one instead of the whv but as we are not living together because my OH is in oz and i m in germany, I don't think I'd get this visa. That's why I'm hoping to get this one so much!

[kiaora!!]

Oh and also, re looking for options, any temporary visa you apply for requires you to be a 'bona fide applicant'

A bona fide applicant for temporary entry is a person who:

1. genuinely intends a temporary stay in New Zealand for a lawful purpose; and
2. in the opinion of a visa or immigration officer is not likely:
1. to remain in New Zealand unlawfully, or
2. to breach the conditions of any permit granted, or
3. to be unable to leave or be removed from New Zealand

my case officer sent the email with the part ...2. to breach the conditions of any permit granted... highlighted and said that they are of the opinion that I am not a bona fide applicant because I have breached my visa conditions in Australia and am likely to breach my visa conditions if granted the whv.
The email further said: please comment on that

and that's exactly where I am at now, I have to comment on why they should believe that I am a bona fide applicant.
Plus another requirement as stated above is that I :

1. genuinely intends a temporary stay in New Zealand for a lawful purpose

which is why I am worried about saying that I want to live there and apply for PR later on, because then they can use that against me and say, you are not genuinly intending to visit NZ temporarily. Because I am intending to stay after that an apply for PR

Will they use this against me??

Anyway as far as applying for a work permit goes, it would be the same story, I d have to be a bona fide applicant and they will believe that I am not because I have breached my visa conditions. The only option other than this is that I apply for PR but I can't do that until I have lived with my partner for 12months, so what options do they actually give me? They can't expect every kiwi to leave the country to live with their partner overseas for 12months until they can come back in and apply for PR?????

[MotherBear]

You're quite right to be cautious about how INZ would see you're particular circumstances in relation to the type of visa you need. The only option is to throw yourself on their mercy and explain your exact situation and leave it up to them to suggest the best way to go about this. It means showing your hand but, you never know, there might be some way you can do this where everyone is happy.

It's a bit unreasonable to expect your partner to leave his job in Oz to go to Germany and start another job, then go back to NZ and start a third job. What if he likes it so much in Germany that he wants to stay there? NZ will have lost one of its sons.

When you were in Oz, how long were you actually in a relationship with your partner? What I mean is were you in the relationship before you went to live with him? That extra time might help to pad out the time you were together if you have proof of it.

Have a read through this if you haven't already read it. It mentions about time spent apart, which is what's happening to you now.

I suppose you could say you're in their hands now and it depends on who you deal with as to how helpful they're prepared to be. If you can think of a good reason for what happened in Oz so that they can be convinced you're not going to repeat it, you might stand a chance.

[kiaora!!]

We met in March 07 and he moved over to oz in June, so from June till mid September we actually lived together, (both our names are on the rental agreement, we have 2 shared accounts, alot of crazily high phonebills etc etc ) so I guess we can prove that although we have been apart we have still been talking to each other twice a day for anything between an hour to up to 5hours.. but still we are not living together now and they are quite strict with that usually, because it is my own fault that we are not living together.

When my case officer asked me before to provide more information I said to her that we want to travel through nz because I want to see where my partner grew up etc.. which is totally the truth, I have never been to the north island, which is also where his family is and I want to meet them as well. Would she think I m trying to sneak my way in if I now say that I am going there to find out if I would want to live there, etc if it's a place where I want to bring up my future kids (because we do want kids pretty soon, after I ve lost our first one in September ) we are quite keen to start a family, but would it be a bad thing to say all this in my letter?
I will also tell her that I am going to apply for a different visa should my circumstances change, and if I cant get a suitable visa we will leave the country before getting in trouble with the law...
I guess yes you are right I have to be honest with her and leave it up to her to decide what to do. At least then I can still apply for a different visa and they wont get suspicious of what the hell I m up to :)

[MotherBear]

When I asked about how long you've been together, I was thinking of this paragraph in the link I posted above.

Please note: If you have been living apart from your partner for any significant period during your relationship, you must also provide evidence of the length of any periods of separation, the reasons for them, and how your relationship was maintained during these periods.

Perhaps you could get away with claiming a few more months because you have been living apart for some time but still maintain close contact with one another, which can be proved by the phone bills and any cards or letters you exchange. There are valid reasons why you are now living apart and the situation is not to your liking, but has been forced upon you through your own 'carelessness'. I think, in this case, you need to prove that the relationship is still strong despite your being apart.

If you want to go for the WHV and wish to appear to be going for a working holiday (rather than to live there permanently at this point) I would think your explanation of wanting to tour around NZ would fit the bill. I would hope the thought of you filling the country with little kiwis might ring a little bell with her as the government is now complaining about the ageing population and they need more young people to 'restock' the place .

I would hope a full and honest account of your situation (lovers separated against their will), a note of regret about what happened in Oz (contrition) and a bit about your partner wanting to show off his country to you (national pride) thrown in for good measure should do it.

Sorry to hear about your sad loss in September.

[kiaora!!]

thank you!

I think I am on the right track now .. I just have to keep thinking that this is not about me or what I want, it's purely what they want and if I have to give something that they want ! if not good qualifications at least I can throw in some good babies :)

I know they want baby kiwis there urgently!! because the amount of people having kids is going down rapidly and kiwis are almost an endangered species :)
They put out incentives for kiwis to have more kids! Also most people in nz having kids are still kids themselves, not many 'families' decide to go for lots of kids anymore, mainly money reasons I guess.

When I fell pregnant my partner rang nz immigration from oz and asked them if we could come to nz to have the baby, they were real keen right away and said of course you can come over now and apply for PR , the health checks can be made via blood tests so your girl won't have to go through xrays and you can have your baby here... I was amazed at how super friendly they were straight away and keen to have us come to nz!

also there are some interesting statistics on the net about people leaving nz and although they' ve got a huge amount of immigrants each year, the amount of kiwis leaving nz has been leading to a loss of population each year although immigrants are coming in in quite big amounts!
but I understand why they want to leave, their options for a good job and much better pay say in Australia are that much better, it's simply worth for them to leave!

[kiaora!!]

I m having problems keeping it short and precise :(

do you think I should just ask her exactly for what information she needs from me?

for example, why it happened, what my plans are etc

because she might only want to hear why it wont happen again and a 5page letter with all the information around it might knock her off her feet haha